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    Ace Attorney He's learning. [OC]

    September 07, 2021

    Ace Attorney He's learning. [OC]

    He's learning. [OC]

    Posted: 06 Sep 2021 12:55 PM PDT

    Tier list organized by how many segments/what types of segments it has

    Posted: 06 Sep 2021 04:23 PM PDT

    Phoenix Wright art by Worvies

    Posted: 06 Sep 2021 06:01 AM PDT

    I think more people need to know about this.

    Posted: 06 Sep 2021 04:25 PM PDT

    Tried upscaling and making a wallpaper of Iris's charms

    Posted: 06 Sep 2021 01:25 PM PDT

    After finally having finished GAAC-2, I can now finally put my finalized tier list in for all of the AA cases in the series... sans the DLC cases of DD and SoJ

    Posted: 06 Sep 2021 06:28 PM PDT

    Kazuma Asougi Commission I made for @starsknice on twt!

    Posted: 06 Sep 2021 08:49 AM PDT

    Maggey Byrde my beloved!!

    Posted: 06 Sep 2021 09:57 PM PDT

    (Artbook) Ryunosuke’s arm guard doesn’t fail to confuse me...

    Posted: 06 Sep 2021 11:01 PM PDT

    Why Don’t People Like SoJ’s Civil Trial?

    Posted: 06 Sep 2021 06:19 PM PDT

    I'm just starting it now, but I see this as such a clever piece of writing in terms of Apollo's character growth. Taking on Phoenix in court, becoming an ace attorney in his own right…. This feels sort of epic! Let me know why there's a lot of hate for it :)

    submitted by /u/rickdr11
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    ""The only time a lawyer can cry is...."

    Posted: 06 Sep 2021 09:19 AM PDT

    What were some incorrect theories/predictions you had about a case?

    Posted: 06 Sep 2021 08:47 PM PDT

    To elaborate: Have you ever had a prediction about a case that was actually wrong and if so, what was it? Like, for example, you thought X was the murderer when it was actually Y or you got a method wrong. Whether it was interesting, strange or just plain dumb; feel free to share it.

    I'll go first.

    In GAA2 Case 2: I thought Shamspeare was that criminal mentioned who'd just lost a crap ton of weight. I think it's because I just automatically expect every killer to use a fake name and...come on, Shamspeare sounds like the fakest name of all time.

    In GAA2 Case 3: I thought the entire police force was in on Assman's death to preserve the legend of the reaper. They mentioned him being a defendant at a Barok trial earlier and I...really don't remember why they did that in the first place.

    submitted by /u/Christianthepupbot
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    It finally arrived:)

    Posted: 06 Sep 2021 08:44 AM PDT

    I’ve only just started GAA2-2, but....

    Posted: 06 Sep 2021 10:14 AM PDT

    Sholmes might just be one of my favorite characters in the series. I can never tell if he's dumb or a genius, but there's always something intriguing about him. Plus I love his theme and his little boxing animation

    submitted by /u/Khan_Cena
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    Most universally disliked case?

    Posted: 06 Sep 2021 04:28 PM PDT

    (I actually like some of these cases)

    View Poll

    submitted by /u/kbmats69
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    I just finished the Great Ace Attorney 2 :)

    Posted: 06 Sep 2021 01:18 PM PDT

    AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH, I JUST WANT TO FUCKINGGGG CRY MANNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNN. I NEVER WAS SO INVESTED IN A MODERN GAME, IF IT'S OT A CONTENDER FOR THE BEST ACE ATTORNEY I DONT KNOW WHAT TO TELL YOU. THE RESOLUTION WAS BRILLIANT. I LOVE THOSE CHARACTERS SO MUCH MAN IT PUTS A TEAR IN MY EYE

    submitted by /u/ClessGames
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    Made this a couple months ago so I don't really like it all that much anymore, but hey, it's Phoenix!

    Posted: 06 Sep 2021 07:41 AM PDT

    Phoenix pilled

    Posted: 06 Sep 2021 11:38 PM PDT

    Looking Back on Recipe for Turnabout

    Posted: 06 Sep 2021 10:03 PM PDT

    The third case of the third game... that's probably a metaphor for something. From what I've seen, while this case has its fans, it remains pretty infamous with some aspects being talked about more often than others. Time to relive those aspects, for better or for worse, by looking back on Recipe for Turnabout.

    History With This Case

    My most recent memories, much like 2-3, matched what I had once assumed was the popular opinion, that being it was one of the worst cases in the series, with a lot of my memories being purely the worst aspects.

    This case will be judged by its characters, trial segments, and investigation segments. Character criticism will revolve around the character's personality, role in the story, and their actions throughout the case. Trial segment criticism will revolve around the enjoyability of the cross examinations, and quality of the story being told during that segment. Investigation segment criticism will revolve around the enjoyability of the general investigations, and quality of the story being told during that segment.

    Court in now in session for the trial of Recipe for Turnabout.

    Characters

    Winston Payne

    Wait, he was in this case?

    Phoenix Wright

    Phoenix is great here. He has the same personality, and while he doesn't do a lot of major things, his final contradiction with the medicine bottle was really clever and a great showcase of how clever he can be.

    Maya Fey

    Maya's okay. While there's nothing majorly wrong with her, I didn't find her getting a job interesting, her personality didn't stick out here as much as it did in previous cases, and this is the first case where she felt more like a background character than a main character.

    Dick Gumshoe

    Gumshoe's great. While his personality doesn't stand out as much as it did in previous cases, he still has charming moments like his psyche lock trial about his lottery ticket, and his interactions with Maggey and him rushing in with the final piece of evidence are fantastic.

    Maggey Byrde

    Maggey's good. While I can't say her personality left a major impact on me, I like that she's returning from 2-1 giving me a motivation to defend her, and I like how she grows from resenting Gumshoe to realizing he was trying to do his best to save her and that he was just doing his job when she was arrested.

    Jean Armstrong

    Jean's a really bad character, and my least favorite of the series so far. There isn't a single thing I like about him. He feels like a character whose only personality traits are "French" and "effeminate" and they aren't utilized in a unique, charming, or even just tolerable manner. I don't find his blackmail subplot interesting, and he rarely stopped being annoying, with those brief non-annoying moments being just periods of existence. The only reason I don't hate him more is because he wasn't infuriatingly annoying, but it says a lot when that's the biggest compliment I can give him.

    Glen Elg

    He dead.

    Furio Tigre

    Furio is meh. While he's not as annoying as Jean, I still can't think of anything I like about him. I didn't find his connection to Viola interesting, and he never felt intimidating or interesting. His motivation, method of murder, impersonating Phoenix, and takedown sound great on paper, but I feel they were made less interesting due to the person connected to these aspects.

    Victor Kudo

    Victor's a bad character. His whining about being old is annoying, his pervertedness feels like a last minute addition to have the plot make sense, and he's not interesting.

    Mia Fey

    Mia's okay. She's basically just herself from 1-3, but exclusively her interactions with Cody, who was substituted with Victor and with a less interesting connection.

    Godot

    Godot's great. He's basically the same as he was in 3-2, and while he doesn't have any fantastic moments like confronting Phoenix or meeting Mia again, he does get development thanks to the scene with the red apron.

    judgemental (adjective): of or concerning the use of judgment.

    The Judge is great. He's the only character in the case to make me laugh more than twice, and his best aspects from previous cases like his interactions with Phoenix and Godot are still present.

    Viola Cadaverini

    Viola's meh. I don't really have any major opinions of her; she's not creepy, not funny, not charming, and I don't really care about her connection to Furio or the case.

    Lisa Basil

    Lisa's meh. This is mostly due to a result of her having a minor appearance, but she wasn't that interesting of a character and I can't think of anything I like about her.

    Overall

    This is an okay cast of characters. I feel like if I wasn't being critical, I would call this a bad cast, since the best new character still isn't as good as the worst returning character, and this case did introduce my new least favorite character.

    Part 1: Investigation

    Investigation

    This is a good investigation. While I didn't find any of the new areas to explore nor all of the gameplay interesting, I liked the psyche lock trials and the variety of conversing, investigating, and presenting.

    Story

    This is a okay opening chapter. While the opening cinematic is cool, defending Maggey again is cool, and it does an overall solid job of forwarding the plot, it wasn't that engaging and I feel Godot's appearance and Victor's psyche lock trial didn't amount to much and didn't have the crutch of being entertaining or intriguing to warrant their existences.

    Overall

    This is an alright first segment. While I didn't find the story to be anything special, the gameplay barely saved it.

    Part 2: Trial

    Cross Examinations

    These cross examinations are meh. I like the variety, but they weren't really fun or challenging as much as they were pressing until an obvious lie appeared, sometimes without the pressing but still with the obviousness, and I felt almost nothing while finding contradictons

    Story

    This was a good chapter of the story. It does a solid job at moving the case forward, and I like how it introduces Godot's colorblindness, but it doesn't feel engaging and none of the revelations felt impactful since most of them revolve around Victor seeing a mirrored image of the event or accidentally lying making them all feel like the same revelation without any sense of variety.

    Overall

    This was an okay trial segment. Every aspect outside of Godot's colorblindness felt at the best, servicable, and at the worst, underwhelming. Depending on how the rest of the case plays out, my biggest issue may not be a split trial.

    Part 3: Investigation

    Investigation

    This is a great investigation segment. While the new locations aren't that special to me, the gameplay felt more fun and interesting overall.

    Story

    This is a good chapter of the story. It's still not engaging, but it at least was more interesting than the first investigation due to more characters to get information from.

    Overall

    This is a really good investigation segment, though I feel I wouldn't like it as much if I hadn't considered how this improved from the first investigation segment.

    Part 4-1: Trial

    Cross Examinations

    These cross examinations are great. There's a good balance of contradictory statements due to and not due to pressing, with the challenge and fun of finding those contradictions being pretty good.

    Story

    This is a great chapter of the story. While there aren't any major character events, it does a good moving the plot forward, and the revelation about a fake victim is cool.

    Overall

    A great trial segment. Not only is this an improvement from the last trial segment, but an improvement from all the segments, with the split trial not ruining the experience in some way.

    Part 4-2: Trial

    Cross Examinations

    These were meh cross examinations. While I think the challenge is fair, I didn't like the punishment for pressing statements like in 2-3, and I wasn't feeling as motivated to find contradictions as I was in any other case before this, or even any other segment before this.

    Story

    This is a good final chapter. I don't think the revelations were that impactful, and I felt the ending shot of Maya watching Maggie eat weenies was a bit cringey, but it does a good moving the story forward, and the way Phoenix wins the case is pretty clever.

    Overall

    This is an okay final segment. It has its good aspects, but this was the first time in the series so far that I was losing interest in a case.

    How I Would Improve

    If I were to try and improve this case while retaining most of its original identity, I would make two changes.

    1. I would fix the new cast. There isn't a new single character I would consider to be good, or even okay, and it comes down to every character either being annoying, uninteresting, or underdeveloped.

    For Furio, I would either focus on him being intimidating with his tough guy attitude, or being wimpy with his interactions with Viola and being put under tension, because having both just makes him an annoying, non-threatening bore.

    For Viola, I feel like a balance of tragic and creepy could work if they made her act more robotic and emotionless. It would make her tragic since it would showcase how much of her humanity and free will was lost because of the accident and how she's basically become mindless either following orders or trends, but she could still be creepy by how unnaturally she would give you information and make you question if she's telling the truth or trying to get you into trouble with Furio. As it stands, she just feels like a possibly poisoned cookie dispenser that occasionally sheds a tear.

    For Jean, I would tone down his personality. The worst part of his character for me was how unsubtle he was, which took away from what could've been charming aspects of his character or tragic aspects of his past. Maybe if he just said an occasional French word while talking and occasionally threw in a complement rather than acting like he took "French is the language of love" a little too literally, that would help to take him more seriously, or at the very least, make him more tolerable.

    For Victor, I would make him talk less. There's not much I can do to improve his comedic potential without getting into the specifics of comedy considering "old" and "perverted" personality traits do have comedic potential, so without considering those, I would just make him talk less since a lot of his dialogue is either useless ranting, or could've been changed from three lines of dialogue to one.

    For Lisa, I wouldn't make her a character. I would make her similar to the Chief at the Criminal Affairs Department: an interactable background asset with a name. Giving her a set of sprites and a psyche lock trial don't work if her only purpose is to stay in one location and tell you information about a person or thing directly connected to said location. At least the Bellboy in 1-2 appeared in court.

    1. I would make the story interesting. Honestly, I can't really to into more detail with this because the main reason for me not being interested with this story is because the characters aren't interesting, so basically just take my improvements of the characters and make any changes to negative aspects needed from this hypothetical case.

    Final Verdict

    This case was okay, but if I weren't being as critical as I am now and took this case at face value, I would be a lot harsher to it. It has some of my least favorite characters, a story that barely holds my attention, and concepts that I feel would be far more interesting in another case. But at the same time, the returing cast is mostly good, there's a good amount of strong moments, and even if I feel the interesting aspects aren't as interesting as they could've been, they are still interesting to think about.

    I think why I'm conflicted on my opinion versus this rating is because my opinion was and is commonly based on purely the best or worst aspects of a case due to them having a greater impact, whereas my rating is based on each individual aspect of a case and giving them equal value to one another. This is part of why I wanted to make these reviews, since my opinion is a lot easier to be altered than my rating, as even though this isn't the objective truth of the quality of this case, I feel there is a greater sense of objectiveness when comparing my critical mindset to my casual mindset. So while I can't say I enjoyed this case, I can say I appreciate it and how it impacted my views as a storyteller and as a consumer.

    6.5/10, it's going between 1-1 and 2-1.

    Case Rankings

    1-4 (9.25/10)

    2-4 (9/10)

    3-1 (8.75/10)

    3-2 (8.5/10)

    2-2 (8.5/10)

    1-5 (8.25/10)

    1-3 (8.25/10)

    1-2 (8/10)

    2-3 (7.5/10)

    1-1 (7/10)

    3-3 (6.5/10)

    2-1 (6.25/10)

    Previous (3-2)

    submitted by /u/KaleBennett
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    Phoenix and Maya art by omen_hohoho

    Posted: 06 Sep 2021 06:04 AM PDT

    Best Final Case Location (main series)

    Posted: 06 Sep 2021 04:51 PM PDT

    Wanted to see which one is the best (combined 1-4 and 1-5 cause why not). This is only rating the location/setting, the quality of the case it appears in is irrelevant. I never saw a locations poll on this sub before, and wanted to try it out cause I was bored. Wasn't sure if a spoiler tag was required but added one just in case

    View Poll

    submitted by /u/ActuallyImJunpei
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    A look at TGAA2-2 from a class lens (Spoilers up to TGAA2-2, obviously)

    Posted: 06 Sep 2021 04:00 PM PDT

    TGAA2-2 is probably one of my favorite cases to come from the duology, and one of its most defining features paired alongside TGAA-4 is its exploration of class issues through London.

    I still maintain that this is still the single most contrived use of the jury system in the entire duology, as Ryu has literally no case to stand on here and only makes it by on sheer narrative convenience that he tries to discredit Shamspeare by focusing on a completely unrelated crime that just happens to tie back to the central attempted murder case here. Having said all that, it still has a few interesting applications.

    The first half of the case is exposing Shamspeare's fake coin trick to get free gas and rip the company off. On paper it makes sense to discredit a witness and their testimony by exposing them as a criminal themselves. However, you expose Shamspeare with very mixed results.

    Jurors are swayed in the moment, but only when Ryu specifically draws attention to the central case issues. Beyond that, several of the jurors don't take even the slightest issue with Shamespare's actions. A lot of the reactions you see to the fake coin trick (including from Soseki himself) amount to "Damn, why didn't I think of that? Why didn't you share that secret?"

    Obviously, Altamont herself takes the largest issue with this practice and even ends up arguing with the jurors and spends a fair amount of the case trying to uphold and protect her company's interests. They're being ripped off, but the jury doesn't particularly care (not that I blame them) because "oh poor wealthy CEO, you."

    Fairplay and Altamont are really focused more on the fact that Shamspeare is a thief while the rest are indifferent until Ryu specifically ties it back to the case, so the attempt to discredit Shamspeare has mixed results based on the income levels of all the witnesses. Even Altamont doesn't particularly care about Soseki or the central murder case but is more interested in how this case affects her company, which is also the driving force behind why Mr. Garrideb attends the trial too as landlord.

    What's most interesting is how Shamspeare deliberately uses this to full effect on the stand—he constantly runs with the idea and tries to position himself as an average Joe trying to get by like the rest of the less wealthier to poorer citizens to hide his more sinister motivation as a repeat criminal willing to murder multiple innocent people to get his big payoff. He deliberately exploits the inherent class issues to gain sympathy with the audience and just runs with admitting to gas theft as long as he can keep his attempted murders hidden.

    It's not until his criminal ties come to light that he really starts to lose favor with everyone, whereas before he was able to at least garner the sympathy of a few despite being a gas thief because who cares about a bit of gas theft if it's just a bunch of wealthy gas barons getting ripped off?

    Even Popeye is driven by his limited income considering the gas company passes the cost of gas theft off to him by deducting it from his pay despite him not being at fault. The choice of the bee motif helps make the joke much more visual, but he pretty much has no choice but to be subservient if he wants to survive just due to the demands of his job and the unreasonable deduction he gets.

    Even better is the fact that there are several points where most of the witnesses aren't even really paying attention to the facts of the case and care more about "hey, gas." One of the jurors makes it clear he's in a rush to end the trial as quickly as possible because he loses out on pay from his job and can't even afford to do jury duty. Altamont kind of pays attention but mostly gets involved to protect her interests and even takes the stand to that end. One of your segments to persuade everyone to "not guilty" has nothing to do with the actual case and everyone is more focused on their thoughts about the gas, with Ryu constantly having to get everyone back on track.

    TGAA-3 existed to demonstrate one of the key failings of the jury system with how easily it can be used to exploit the people and manipulate others in your favor. TGAA2-2 demonstrates another failing in that a jury of your peers aren't particularly incentivized to pay attention to the facts of the case either because of the financial burden it puts on them or just having no way to check their own prejudices.

    TGAA-4 also did a similar thing since it used several of the same jurors. Even the setting of both cases, the ramshackle rental building has a lot of details like the bricked up windows that help further push the class struggles to that end.

    I think TGAA2-2 is much better in that respect because TGAA-4 tries to bite off a bit more than it can chew. I talked about the way TGAA-4 uses both an intersection of race and class issues in the post here. Taken alone, I think both individual ideas work really well, but together keep clashing with each other because they're trying to tell two different story angles that conflict with each other and end up undermining both of them.

    I think it's most telling with how Van Zieks is handled in that case. He makes it no secret that he in part suspects Soseki purely because he's Japanese. Additionally, TGAA-4 is the single best case (at least at the start) for how it capitalizes on the racial prejudice in the games. Up until this point, Ryu and Susato have only heard praises about the British courts and their supposedly advanced society that Japan was willing to bend over backwards to model only to see that that ideal image was shattered horribly. This is right after they had their trust betrayed (not that they had any real time to assess) by Scrooge McBurned and Ryu is already facing several doubts about who he is and what he stands for.

    One of the biggest issues I have with TGAA-4 is how it squanders such a great start with making full use of this and capitalizing on the kinship Soseki has with Ryu/Susato with having met fellow Japanese citizens who can not only defend him, but can understand his situation. He already deals with a language barrier, harassment from the locals that drives him to stay at home most of the time, and gets blatantly profiled by several of the legal officials who don't take him seriously. They highlight it best with the fact that he takes the time to study the nuances of their language and culture through the literature and gets no respect in turn for it.

    Where I think that gets kind of iffy is that the game also tries to do the class commentary to the detriment of the previously established elements with Soseki. It just kind of petters out to everyone shrugging and saying we all could do a bit better and squandering pretty much the entire setup of the kinship between Soseki and Ryu/Susato.

    Using an excerpt from an old post here:

    > Typically, this kind of story arc involves the use of a bigoted environment to contextualize the actions of why the defendant is so fearful to speak honestly about what happened in the case and for the lawyer to have even more of an uphill battle. Offhand, some movies like Marshall and Blind Faith use this same story structure. The racist characters are typically used as obstacles or used to contextualize the brutality and unjust environment (ex. racist jurors) the minority characters face including the defendant, maybe their families, and the lawyer having to deal with the racism in the courtroom itself.

    The game tries to simultaneously do this class commentary in TGAA-4 to contextualize the behavior of the londoners. A shortstaffed police force leads to an overworked Pat/Rola O'malley for example which is the driving force behind his coverup. But it also kind of awkwardly conflicts with trying to also do the kinship with Soseki and just ends weirdly with trying to both-sides an issue that really shouldn't be by acting like Soseki was just being weird ol' Soseki at points. This is absolutely a "less is more" situation as both ideas taken alone work really well but they conflict together, which is how I feel TGAA2-2 is better for trying to do less and centering on one idea. Pat and Rola are among some of my least favorite witnesses in the entire series because of the way TGAA-4 has a really clunky relationship with both race and class. They managed to be even worse in the fan translation.

    Interestingly, if you look at Van Zieks in TGAA-4 through only a class lens, then it's easy to see him in a pretty sympathetic light for understanding the circumstances the O'malleys are in and it's easy to see that the intended significance of this scene is to show you another aspect of his personality if he's willing to show lenience.

    I think this is one of the other issues with the game where it just treats this like it's sufficient to address the central misfire of having a character you're going to have to be around for two games be a virulent racist and having them have positive traits in other respects doesn't negate that. Dude could have a whole case of petting puppies and it still wouldn't resolve the issue. I'd imagine this was done to be similar to some of the moments with say Edgeworth in case 1-3 where he goes out of his way to help you solve the case, which has so much significance specifically because of his horrible behavior in the prior case. The game really seems to compartmentalize Van Zieks behavior to the story's detriment.

    I'm not really going to focus too much on Van Zieks for this post as I've already talked about him more than extensively in this post if that topic fancies you. There's no divorcing the intersections of race and class from the topic at hand though, so I think the writers weren't really in full control there and didn't execute that intersection very well in TGAA-4.

    I still have a number of issues with TGAA2-2, (its pacing, the awkward placement,the way it undercuts the emotional gravity of Olive's attempted suicide, and the constant need to bring up or centralize commentary around Olive Green's weight by almost everyone talking about her), but I do think it's miles ahead of TGAA-4 in terms of how it depicts the class struggle and how it ties back to Shamspeare.

    Shamspeare is one of the best pieces of garbage to come from the duology though.

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